Birty Dastards Jeep Club

Tech Forum => Workshop => Topic started by: Jeeper Creeper on May 27, 2009, 10:13:27 AM

Title: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on May 27, 2009, 10:13:27 AM: Received it from Llama yesterday and was gonna start on it today but it's pissing down hopefully it's nicer tomorrow.

Anyways, will I need a spring compressor or any other unusual tools?

Cheers
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: greggmo on May 27, 2009, 10:40:05 AM: you will need a spring compressor mate. if you follow the instructions with the kit you should have it done in a day/day and half.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on May 27, 2009, 11:09:30 AM: didn't see any instructions... gonna go look again.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Nosebolt on May 27, 2009, 11:13:38 AM: instructions can be downloaded here (http://http://www.roughcountry.com/install/PERF1652.pdf)
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Dave69 on May 27, 2009, 06:51:00 PM: if you buy the spring compressor type that consists of two long rods and a small hook at each end make sure they are sitting sound while you compress the spring, if not then serious injury might be inflicted.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: greggmo on May 27, 2009, 10:21:30 PM: yup. be careful with them.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on May 28, 2009, 11:23:44 AM: Got one wheel up and need advice already

How do I get the bolt on top of the shock off? Badly rusted and the shock just turns around.

What do you guys do to keep it from turning?

EDIT: got it off with some help from my neighbour. Now fitting the new longer spring is gonna be a mission...
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Dave69 on May 28, 2009, 04:45:22 PM: if your binning the old suspension then it doesn't matter how it comes off so there is no real need to be nice if the bolts are siezed in place. an angle grinder helps wonders or some vice grip pliers. just dont go cutting the dampers in half as they have pressure and oil inside
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: tim_aka_tim on May 28, 2009, 05:14:42 PM: stilsons
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on May 28, 2009, 05:16:26 PM: The front done! Gonna have a sandwich and start on the back. Will post some pics later.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on May 28, 2009, 05:46:28 PM: Urgent help required: how do I get the top nut of the rear shock off? The shock disappears behind the frame and I can't see it's top end.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: isle of man on May 28, 2009, 05:56:16 PM: From memory it's two 13mm bolts either side of the shock - I can double check on my spare Wrangler when I get home.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on May 28, 2009, 05:58:13 PM: But how do I get to the top one?
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: tim_aka_tim on May 28, 2009, 06:07:23 PM: I never owned one, but....

From http://www.4x4xplor.com/nth-shockshifters.html (http://www.4x4xplor.com/nth-shockshifters.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)

1. To begin the installation of your new Nth Degree Mobility Shock Shifters, remove the rear shocks from your Jeep TJ using a 13mm socket and 12" extension for the top frame mounts and a 15mm socket and 18mm wrench for lower the axle mounts.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on May 28, 2009, 07:40:47 PM: Either they are not 13mm or my socket didn't go on properly, keeps slipping every time I try turn it. But never mind I'll do the back next week. It claimed a quoter of my tooth and my arms in too much pain as it is. Gonna buy a longer extension and jet wash the underside so I don't get showered with dirt.

Anyways some before and after pics. When it's finished I'll add some afterer pics.

(http://http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa66/tadaska/B4.jpg)

(http://http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa66/tadaska/Closeup.jpg)

(http://http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa66/tadaska/Afterdriversside.jpg)

(http://http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa66/tadaska/Afterpassengerside.jpg)
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: momos on May 28, 2009, 07:48:10 PM: :lol:
you`re gonna neeeeeed bigger wheels
look forward to part deux
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on May 28, 2009, 07:52:28 PM: I'd rather there was no part deux but there is no way back now.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: momos on May 28, 2009, 07:53:52 PM: good for you!
no likes saggy bums
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Bulldog67 on May 28, 2009, 08:17:20 PM
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: greggmo on May 28, 2009, 11:47:07 PM: cool upside down front shocks. that is a nice change. the rear shock bolts usualy break and are just a bastard. you cant get to the top as it is a captive nut. sometimes they spin but usualy the break. drill and tappin time mate wear yer goggles cos swarf aint nice in yer eye holes.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on May 29, 2009, 01:33:10 AM: Man.... really not looking forward to it.

Anything can be done to avoid them snap?
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: JamesH on May 29, 2009, 07:57:50 AM: Greggmo - His shocks might be the right way up, that's the way my Bilstein's had to be fitted
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: tartanzj on May 29, 2009, 01:32:43 PM: Ah! Brings back memories of my solo attempt at a lift install. Whole weekend of banged head, scraped knuckled, aching arms and full vocabulary of expletives. Just remember it'll be well worth it when you get there.

Nowt wrong with shocks on that way, mine are that way too so it must be right
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on May 29, 2009, 01:42:54 PM: Is it easy to take out the petrol tank?

With it out I'd have a better access and hopefully could clean up the threads before attempting to remove the bolts.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: isle of man on May 29, 2009, 02:38:28 PM: Depends how much petrol you have in the tank - relatively painless task.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Dave69 on May 29, 2009, 05:51:33 PM: you might need a wheel barrow for the tank removal.........

viewtopic.php?f=37&t=9337 (http://birtydastardsjeepclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=9337" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Bishops Finger on May 29, 2009, 10:42:10 PM: Man the old wheel barrow technique... :lol:
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: greggmo on May 29, 2009, 11:24:00 PM: i didnt sugest the shock where wrong but they are upside downies. you really dont need to move the tank to fit a lift mate. way more work than ya need to do.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on May 30, 2009, 12:30:24 AM: Quote from: "greggmo"
you really dont need to move the tank to fit a lift mate. way more work than ya need to do.

But you yourself said the bolts may snap and if they do then the tank will definitely have to come out and there will be the extra work of sorting it all out. I did have a peek through the gap above the frame and the bolts look rusty as hell. So I reckon might as well do it the hard way and might save myself the extra work later.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: greggmo on May 30, 2009, 12:55:15 AM: just soak em in wd or diesel and try em. they might come out and they might brake but movin the tank aint gonna help ya get at em anyway to be honest. the exhaust is sort of in the way but just use a load of extension bars to reach em. trust me we've done a few. if they brake just drill and tap em. it is the easier way honest mate. even if you can get at the back of the nuts you wont hold em without them snapin anyway and good luck getting a new nut in the same space. just tryin to help mate. by all means do it your way but tank out seems like a hell of a mess about to me when they might even just come out.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on May 30, 2009, 01:47:44 AM: I'll see how I feel about it Monday. Don't really mind the extra work, it'd give me a chance to clean the dirt out and see what's what. Might even get the snapped back seat bolts out if that's where they are.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: greggmo on May 30, 2009, 11:58:18 PM: put up a photo of the bolts your on about mate. just so i know we are talkin about the same thing?
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on May 31, 2009, 08:47:02 AM: I'm talking about the 4 bolts that hold the upper ends of the rear shocks. I only mentioned the back seat because 2 out of the 4 bolts holding it to the floor have snapped (didn't know there was an easy way to remove the seat).
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: PtP on May 31, 2009, 08:36:30 PM: I’ve done mine and two other TJs in the last three years and I didn’t have to remove the tank. As Greggmo says, if the bolts holding the top bar-pins look rusty, then give them a good soaking with WD40 or penetrating oil etc. then use a suitably long extension bar and just reach up and carefully undo the bolts and keep your fingers crossed. I’ve never had a problem with the bolts breaking etc.

The chances are that if the bar-pin bolts have rusted to a point where they break whilst undoing them, then the tank bolts might be the same, again I didn’t have ant problems removing mine! Or using a wheelbarrow.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on June 01, 2009, 04:11:25 PM: The tank is off and the driver's side been done. Gonna do the other side now but one of the bolts is a bit chewed up, will have to come up with something clever to get it out.

Unfortunately I broke the plastic thingy that connects the three petrol pipes together behind the tank. Any ideas where to get a replacement fast?
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: MOCAJ on June 01, 2009, 08:02:08 PM: lighthouse for the thingy, if not then its stealer

cant believe you took the tank out, but good luck on the chewed up bolt
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Dave69 on June 01, 2009, 08:06:16 PM: if you onlu have one chewed up bolt then you have been doing well. get a photobucket account and post some pictures
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on June 01, 2009, 08:18:28 PM: All I have left is that one bolt and put the tank back in (and find a thingy).

If anyone has any ideas or suggestions please share them with me. Would be nice to get it sorted tomorrow but haven't got a clue what to do with that bolt.

Cheers

Edit: the 13mm socket just slips when I turn it a bit harder.

(http://http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa66/tadaska/damagednut.jpg)
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: tim_aka_tim on June 01, 2009, 08:38:20 PM: You probably need a six-sided socket.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: JamesH on June 01, 2009, 08:50:35 PM: As Tim said go 6 sided - and maybe a 1/2" will fit over??
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: donk498 on June 01, 2009, 09:21:00 PM: Or hammer a 12mm on to it..............
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: greggmo on June 01, 2009, 09:28:15 PM: they are 1/2 not 13. yanks dont like mm's remember.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on June 01, 2009, 11:19:04 PM: I was thinking six-sided socket too. Hopefully I can find a 1/2" one tomorrow.

Thanks guys
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: greggmo on June 01, 2009, 11:22:17 PM: i am thinkin drill and tap is the future but good luck dood. still cant beleive you took the tank out.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Warthog on June 02, 2009, 02:22:52 AM: Quote from: "greggmo"
i am thinkin drill and tap is the future but good luck dood. still cant beleive you took the tank out. =D> Well ya gotta give JC credit, he's stuck with it. Hopefully the torment will end in success

Maybe a trip to Machine Mart and get the set of these: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/5PC-IRWIN-BOLT-GR ... 7C294%3A24 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/5PC-IRWIN-BOLT-GRIP-EXTRACTOR-SET-USA-MADE-TOOL-IN-CASE_W0QQitemZ120371955713QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Hand_Tools_Equipment?hash=item1c06ba4801&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1683%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A2%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A0%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A24" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)

Drilliing it out would work though. The heat generated by the drilling may well loosen the bugger enough, to get him out using a 1/2 socket? 13mm is a bit too big for this job.

Im sure the thingy could be replaced by a Zip Tie?

If not? ave a butchers on here: http://www.cbsonline.co.uk/index.asp (http://www.cbsonline.co.uk/index.asp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)

ATB
Mark
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: captain cavalier on June 02, 2009, 08:56:40 AM: try a 1/2" Impact socket
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on June 02, 2009, 08:57:22 AM: Quote from: "greggmo"
still cant beleive you took the tank out.

It's good to get familiar with your car and it's very dirty, the poor thing needs a bath.

Got to wait till 2pm to borrow the company car so I can go looking for bits
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Nosebolt on June 02, 2009, 09:40:04 AM: JC just use my excuse, "I'm taking it off to paint it so it don't go rusty" it's the perfect excuse when you do a job the hard way
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on June 02, 2009, 09:59:54 AM: This is the petrol line thingy I broke:

(http://http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa66/tadaska/petrollinethingy.jpg)
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Nosebolt on June 02, 2009, 10:11:15 AM: most car spares shops sell universal fuel line T piece for about 2 quid,
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Warthog on June 02, 2009, 02:35:44 PM: Quote from: "Jeeper Creeper"
This is the petrol line thingy I broke:

(http://http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa66/tadaska/petrollinethingy.jpg)

There on here:
http://www.cbsonline.co.uk/tees-178-c.asp (http://www.cbsonline.co.uk/tees-178-c.asp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: tim_aka_tim on June 02, 2009, 03:52:03 PM: They sell pipe fittings for poly tube in B&Q.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Dave69 on June 02, 2009, 09:05:03 PM: multipoint sockets are bad for siezed bolts. get a hex or 6 point socket and you should either get the bolt out or shear it off.

a motorfactors should be able to sort you out with a plstic T piece for the fuel pipe
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on June 02, 2009, 09:27:20 PM: I go to Halfords part's counter and ask for a six-sided 1/2" socket. The guy checks the socket cabinet and tells me they don't stock them. Walking away I notice a box of sockets at the end of his counter "£5 for two or £3 each". The first socket I pick up is 1/2" six-sided

Anyway, it did the job quite well and the suspension is now done. Just got to put the tank back in.

T piece of the right size was impossible to find anywhere so I went to PIRTEK and got myself a proper posh one:

(http://http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa66/tadaska/Tpiece.jpg)
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: tim_aka_tim on June 02, 2009, 09:39:00 PM: Hope that's brass or copper rated for petrol, as regular copper is unsuitable for petrol lines.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on June 02, 2009, 09:48:23 PM: I think it's brass as it's pale yellow. Copper is dark reddish colour isn't it?
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: tim_aka_tim on June 02, 2009, 09:59:48 PM: Pirtek allegedly know what they're doing, so as long as you told them it was for petrol, you'll be fine.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on June 02, 2009, 10:03:13 PM: I did tell them what's for so should be alright.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on June 03, 2009, 12:37:51 PM: Project "suspension lift" has been complete!

The ride is nice but I now bounce about even more than before.

(http://http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa66/tadaska/25lift.jpg)

Is that enough for a sock travel? It's not going to bottom up or something?

(http://http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa66/tadaska/rearshockgap.jpg)
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Bulldog67 on June 03, 2009, 12:52:39 PM: :lol:
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: captain cavalier on June 03, 2009, 01:18:29 PM: Is that enough for a sock travel? It's not going to bottom up or something?

my socks travel all the way up my feet to my ankles
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: momos on June 03, 2009, 01:43:00 PM: horray `lift` beers pls
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Bulldog67 on June 03, 2009, 02:50:28 PM: Quote from: "captain cavalier"
Is that enough for a sock travel? It's not going to bottom up or something?

my socks travel all the way up my feet to my ankles

I reckon he is on a wind up CC, the dood wears sandals:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=9798&start=25 (http://www.birtydastardsjeepclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=9798&start=25" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)

That's why he is Jeeper Creeper, shortened that stands as JC, which as we all know, is that bloke Jesus Christ from that story book some nutters love, hence the footwear, its all bloody obvious really
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Bishops Finger on June 03, 2009, 05:13:02 PM: Brian wore sandles as well....
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: tim_aka_tim on June 03, 2009, 05:16:03 PM: (http://http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/90/Chapman_as_Brian.jpg)

Oi, leave me out of this!
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: greggmo on June 03, 2009, 06:47:42 PM: those shocks look to me like they will bottom out way before you hit the bump stops. did they not send some bump stop extensions with you lift kit?
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: greggmo on June 03, 2009, 06:51:16 PM: lookin at it mate i think the bump stop is built into your shocks with those big rubber bumpers. might be ok mate.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on June 04, 2009, 12:06:22 AM: I did get 2" pucks to extend the bumpstops but I requested them to be sent to me so I can put 33" tyres on. The lift is designed for 31" tyres and doesn't come with bumpstops I believe. So didn't bother fitting them in, good for 31" must be good for 27". But even with the 2" bumpstop extensions the gap will be way bigger than the amount of down travel those shocks have. A bit worrying to be honest.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on June 04, 2009, 12:08:45 AM: Quote from: "Bulldog67"
Quote from: "captain cavalier"
Is that enough for a sock travel? It's not going to bottom up or something?

my socks travel all the way up my feet to my ankles

I reckon he is on a wind up CC, the dood wears sandals:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=9798&start=25 (http://www.birtydastardsjeepclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=9798&start=25" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)

That's why he is Jeeper Creeper, shortened that stands as JC, which as we all know, is that bloke Jesus Christ from that story book some nutters love, hence the footwear, its all bloody obvious really

SLIPPERS! They are my comfortable leather slippers!
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: greggmo on June 04, 2009, 12:11:42 AM: you wont clear 33's with that lift mate. on road maybe. those shocks do look a bit long to be honest. give em a shout and check they sent the rigt ones for your kit.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on June 04, 2009, 12:35:22 AM: Will give RC a call on Monday.

Got another question...

The instructions say to check if it goes into 4H or is it 4L and it does but my gears feel different and maybe the clutch too. All the gears that are selected by pulling the lever (2nd,4th and reverse) don't go in as nicely as before, as if they don't go in all the way. And the clutch feels like it's not disengaging totally and it's especially felt when selecting the reverse. Can those things be affected by a lift?

EDIT: Transfer case drop 1".
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: PtP on June 04, 2009, 10:43:28 AM: Quote from: "Jeeper Creeper"
....... Can those things be affected by a lift?

EDIT: Transfer case drop 1".
Yes they can be as the rubber gaiter around the gear lever could be blocking the gear lever from engaging properly as the box has been dropped.

After I fitted my lift, I dropped my box using piles of large penny-washers and longer skid-plate bolts, but I decided that I would fit a 1” engine mount lift kit instead and remove the washers.

Here’s a photo of what I fitted

(http://http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j272/mmore514/DSCN3328.jpg)

But you’ll also have to think about lifting the radiator; some kits come with the brackets. I’ve already got an electric fan fitted, so it was not a problem for me. I think you could also get away with fitting a 1” body lift which will help with fitting those 33” tyres. But next you’ll need a re-gear! Once you start, it never seems to stop.

(http://http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j272/mmore514/DSCN3342.jpg)
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on June 04, 2009, 11:23:39 AM: Just been down under and yes the lever is pressing against the rubber gaiter making it harder to to select gears.

But that's because the lever has bends in it. I reckon if it was straight or less bent there would be no probs.

Suggestions?

(http://http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa66/tadaska/gearleaver.jpg)
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on June 05, 2009, 09:34:44 AM: According to some dude on JP forums RC performance 2.2 shocks are too long and they know it. Phoned up David at Llama and he's gonna give them a call. I hope they send me a replacement. Those are only good for flat roads when I go over bigger bumps they kick my back up.
Title: Re: Rough Country 2.5" lift
Post by: Jeeper Creeper on July 14, 2009, 02:19:29 PM: An update:

New shocks arrived yesterday and were fitted today.

Front ones are the same length, the back ones 1/2 inch sorter. Will be OK for road use IMO, for off-roading... don't know, never done any.

Replaced the whole lot. Even the front ones despite them being the same length. And boy am I glad I did! What a difference the new shocks made! Before the ride was so bouncy it was making people feel sick! Now it's so much smoother. Looks like they had more than just a length problem. I'm glad it's been sorted, now I can drive without having to hold tight onto the steering wheel.

Big thanks do David from Llama 4X4 for organising a replacement for me! Can't recommend him highly enough!