Birty Dastards Jeep Club
Tech Forum => Workshop => Topic started by: ferretjuggler on May 25, 2014, 02:57:42 PM
-
Specifically on an AMC V8
Common wisdom is to recycle the system off a Big Block Chevy, namely the 454.
I'm wondering if an alternative system could be built using bits commonly available in Europe?
I'd guess that the throttle body would be the hardest thing to substitute
AFAIK the Holley Pro Jection system uses a GM 454 throttle body so it's probably close to being ideal.
I'm just wondering if anyone has seriously considered using European bits and pieces?
-
How about the megasquirt system.....the people who also do mega jolt sparks system"
I think KIng CJ has this on his,360
I researched all the easy plug and play stuff last week when I was in 454 search mode and yes even I could make it work but $2,300 when a Quadrajet seems to be $400
-
The Edelbrock TPI is $3500 from BJs :icon_eek:
I assume that that $2300 doesn't include shipping and import duty :017:
This is why good folk in the US resort to pulling bits off old Chevies in wrecking yards.
I found a guy on the IFSJA forums who makes a few extra dollars by sourcing the relevant bits for other people.
Could be the way to go :017:
I'd be still be interested in finding out if there was a way to build a TBI or TPI system using bits commonly available in the UK.
I suppose that the major problem is going to be the capacity of the injectors used on European cars with their puny little engines :011:
-
Ferret dood - link me into the procurer on IFSJA please
Its something I fancy but I cant ever imagine I will have the spare cash to spurt £2000-3000 on it
-
No problem
I'll retrace my steps on the forum and dig him out.
BTW the Howell TBI from BJs is only $1300.
-
he had one of them and sold it to a nice chap
-
Yes I was just thinking about that.
Surely that CJ should have been an ideal candidate for some sly asset stripping?
-
as i remember the nice chap then sold it on to a eurolander who did not realise he could not use it in his home country and it got broke anyways
-
Mr Hindsight is a wonderfully annoying bastard - would have saved me a frickin fortune
-
mr hindsight is a total jerk cos if he wernt i would have a good garge hack
-
Mr Hindsight is a wonderfully annoying bastard - would have saved me a frickin fortune
You seem to be letting yourself slip a little Mr Daley.
More animal cunning required.
BTW what sort of fuel consumption did you get from that first two door Cherokee you had?
I'm trying to decide between the Quadratrac system or the part time system on the Laredo.
I think the best I ever got from my Black Cherokee was just under 13 mpg but that was with a dodgy carb.
-
TBH I was thoroughly underwhelmed by that CJ7 with fuel injection - maybe due to everyone wanking over it so perhaps was expecting too much - so again TBH thought I would maximise profit by leaving it on when I sold it
got 15mpg from the 401 when I was running it in, but in normal use they have all averaged around 50p per mile
-
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNIVERSAL-HIGH-FLOW-INTAKE-65MM-THROTTLE-BODY-ADAPTER-SILVER-BLUE-RED-/251196080270?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item3a7c74008e
could be of use
-
Thanks for that.
Finest Quality that the Peoples Republic can provide.
I might even manage to read the description when those ASSHOLES at T-Mobile actually give me some bandwidth :icon_twisted:
Ade, I was actually referring to the very first two door you had - the narrow track.
IIRC that had an AMC 360 and Jeeps "improved" transmission which basically means higher gearing and an option of part time 4x4.
Jeep were claiming 15-20 mpg (on US gallons)
-
i had a fair old few of these oldest was a 77 newest was 92 so covered all the automatic tranny options and only ever noticed thirsty mode
if you look at the history of these gorgeous old barges you will eventually come to cafe the corparate average fuel economy blurb Chrysler used this government mandate to kill off the wagoneer as it was 13mpg
there was a manual 6 potter high geared poverty one in about 83 that could scrape 20mpg but was not popular apparently
-
I haven't noticed any particular mpg difference in any old truck running a V8
-
I got the option of the '70's Quadratrac with Dana 44 axles on a 4.10 ratio.
Or Chrysler 727 /NP208 with the FSJ WT corpse 20 at the back and LH drop D44 at the front.
Ratio is 3.07
PO ran these with 33" tyres must have been pretty tall gearing.
I assume that if you run an auto box with too high gearing it just overworks the auto producing lots of excess heat and also shitty fuel consumption :017:
Throw into the equation the fact that I've got five complete Quadratrac transmissions and three sets of matching
WT axles and I suppose it's becoming a real no brainer.
I only got one of everything for the Chrysler set up an the torque converter is fucked cos the moron PO drilled holes in it :banghead:
-
BTW Ade,
PM'd you about the Junkyard TBI Dude.
Now trading as Custom EFIS
Apparently the guy is a bit of a Nutty Professor type.
Very clever but no business sense, he has really pissed some of his customers off.
Best avoided IMHO
-
Cheers dood :greggmo:
TBH running a 5.9 V8 aint gonna be frugal whatever ya do - unless it involves LPG
-
Apparently the guy has started to manufacture his own throttle bodies.
Now when you buy a Howell TBI kit ( and possibly Holley) you get a new GM throttle body assembly.
Not gonna write him off totally, could be useful, but treat with caution.
Getting very conflicting claims for V8 gas milage on the IFSJA forums.
There's always gonna be some dickhead claiming some fantastic figures.
Like your local pub liar.
But I've seen plenty of claims for 18-20 mpg from a V8 and remember that their gallons are smaller.
-
Just use common sense - a nice clean stock 4.0 XJ with lightweight unibody construction gives 20 mpg combined use, a big FSJ with a V8 isn't going to unless everything is running perfect, the tyres are at 40psi and you're doing 56mph behind an HGV.
-
:imwitstupid: as a dood on Sunday said to me when chatting about the Chief - "when it looks and sounds as cool as that who gives a fuck about mpg"
-
18 is prob achievable on a steady motorway run
-
yeah but you will also wanna top yaself from the tedium
-
:imwitstupid: as a dood on Sunday said to me when chatting about the Chief - "when it looks and sounds as cool as that who gives a fuck about mpg"
Thats so funny yet so dumb....................it dont matter bow sexy it is if you cant afford to fuel it
-
Had a pub landlord near me who passed the following comment about his low life thieving and swindling clientele.
" People shouldn't become addicted to drugs they can't afford"
Probably the same could be said about an obsession with American Old Iron :die:
-
I believe the thought process is its better to drive 100 miles in something you love than 300 miles in a tragic piece of mildly fuel efficient garbage
-
My desire to master the Black Art of fuel injection is driven by more than a need for better mpg.
Someone once described the carburettor as " an ingenious device for supplying the wrong fuel air mixture at all engine loads and speeds"
Even though I'm a technophobe at heart, I don't like carbs one little bit.
An injected engine is always going to run better than something that has to suck up its fuel from a lump of Mazak.
Better starting.
Better warm up
More power.
And better milage too unless you drive like a total psychopath.
-
The stuff I was googling last week sold me on the plug and play eeezeee fuel injection.or whatever the yanks choose to call it.
Taking a junkyard 454 known to make a factory 245, the cleaned it up using all standard parts and just,put,a flat tappet cam in........ Standard heads cleaned up the lot....... Total spend $2k they then did some dyno runs..... With quadrajet had to change jets......lots but got 416 BHP....
With the plug and play injection......they managed to iron out all the glitches that a carb couldn't....
It got 409bhp.....but mpg was 13/14 as opposed to 9.......
Just costs a bit though :icon_twisted:
-
Just shows that you CAN have your cake and eat it.
I'd be ecstatic to get 14 mpg from a 454.
One good thing about old Jeeps is that at least they run good on unleaded.
And our wonderful government will never put the price up sky high because of all the voters running little hatchbacks.
-
Meanwhile, back in the real world and on the original thread, the answer to your first question is 'Yes'. But I only did it to a 4.2L.
I now have a 4.2 with Megasquirt 2 plus aditional code to give wasted spark and semi-seqental injection (ie the injectors give 1 shot of fuel on the valve when it's closed and a second when it's open). I'm using a 4.0 inlet manifold and standard XJ injectors, how I got here is a long story but suffice it to say that you MUST ensure all the donor parts for a scrapyard conversion are in running condition before you even consider using them, if they arent you wont know where to start any diagnosis.
And dont forget to factor in a wide band lambda sensor and dyno tuning!
-
That's interesting.
Cheers.
Have you gained much performance wise compared with just slinging a power tech 4.0 in?
When I say performance I'm not just talking about maximum power.
I appreciate that there is much more to it than that.
-
Unfortunately not!
I did get the pleasure of confusing a whole bunch of muppets who wanted to see under the bonnet and then couldn't figure out how the spark got from the distributor to the spark plugs though!
My plug leads run along the top of the tappet cover and then disappear through the firewall to the coil I nicked out of a Ford Cougar.
My main reason for going this route was because my nipper chose it as part of his motorsport degree and because the 4.2 only had a few hundred miles on it since it's last major rebuild.
Now starts and runs better and best of all it doesn't keep overfuelling and stall on steep assents or descents. That really used to crank me up, it was as if the ungrateful lump wanted to either kill me or itself.
But truth be told, it would have been easier and simpler to swap in a 4.0.
But this way, if I stumble across a poorly 4.0 long block I can stroke it in my own sweet time and then drop that in without any hassle as I already have all the rest of the kit mounted up, well that's what I tell myself anyway!
Delk is really the man you want to talk to, he has a stroked 4.0 with efi and has far more experience than I do.
-
One for Jet
http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=170085
-
You setting yours up like that ade
-
It's only 10k - i may just buy 3 of them :003:
-
Life expectancy at full power?
Not long I'll bet.
-
A carb full of fuel
-
To be fair.
They managed to make it run reliably long enough to do a full dyno test.
I was more impressed by a junkyard 454 pushing out 400+ BHP TBH.
Real usable everyday Redneck power. :098: