Birty Dastards Jeep Club
Tech Forum => Workshop => Topic started by: gregwho on January 30, 2015, 08:04:14 PM
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Hi Guys, im after some advice on a couple of parts for my WJ (although engine doesn't matter for this). The first is I've noticed the suspension is feeling soft and spongy (its done about 100k) and thinking about changing springs and shocks, but instead of replacing like for like, I wanted go upgrade. Are there any recommendations for good makes and models of springs and shocks? I don't have a loft fitted, just slightly larger than stock tyres.
My second ask is around a reversing system. I've been looking for ages to try and find a reversing sensor system that can give a visual output to an in dash/mirror screen but I can't find anything that really nails it, so just wondered if anyone else has looked for a similar thing before.
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Just thinking about the suspension for now, ask yourself honestly, what are you using the car for ?
If its 99% road use, then go stock or no more than 2 inches if you just want a better look with near stock handling.
Then, how deep is your wallet ? This can be done on a budget with spacers or you can have a proper set up like Old Man Emu or other makes somewhere in the middle.
First you have to be honest with answers to the above, when you have decided, folks can give their experiences more tailored to your needs & wants.
Good luck :icon_biggrin:
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As above think hard about the use it's going to get.
My WJ/G has got a 4" Rough Country long arm lift and runs 16" modular wheels with MT tyres. It handles like a cow on rollerskates on the road, but is excellent when green laning, which is what I use it for in the main.
As for reversing sensors, I've got steel bumpers and good eye sight, so don't need them!
(https://birtydastards.com/frm/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi17.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb73%2FGMad%2F10441491_10154896232070343_6779729330562211551_n_zpsiiuosty7.jpg&hash=308dec9b6f6c386ae492a4e475d4b5f9284d13a8) (http://s17.photobucket.com/user/GMad/media/10441491_10154896232070343_6779729330562211551_n_zpsiiuosty7.jpg.html)
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As for reversing sensors, I've got steel bumpers and good eye sight, so don't need them!
:098:
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I just re-read my original post, and hadn't realised how badly constructed it was....note to self, don't use mobile with autocorrect to post!
Just thinking about the suspension for now, ask yourself honestly, what are you using the car for ?
If its 99% road use, then go stock or no more than 2 inches if you just want a better look with near stock handling.
Then, how deep is your wallet ? This can be done on a budget with spacers or you can have a proper set up like Old Man Emu or other makes somewhere in the middle.
First you have to be honest with answers to the above, when you have decided, folks can give their experiences more tailored to your needs & wants.
Good luck :icon_biggrin:
Absolutely agree, and being totally honest with myself, as much as I want to take the Jeep out and get muddy, its likely going to be 99.99999999% on road, and the occasional puddle. So, I'll stick to stock sized shocks and springs (no lift), but instead of getting a EuroCarParts or other cheaper replacement, I wondered if there was a make/model that would give me a better, slightly stiffer on road ride experience. At the moment, it kind of wallows round corners, and the front dips if I brake a bit hard etc. I have purchased and had delivered an Addco upgraded rear stabliiser from the states, so hopefully that will help to stiffen stuff up too.
As for the reversing system, I used to use the tow bar as my "sensor" for when to stop, but my wifes car has a nice visual display and now that i've been spoiled by driving that for a while, I'd like it in the Jeep too :jpshakehead: to be honest, its just a nice to have and not really that important in the scheme of things!
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asking what make of suspension to fit will always end up brand specific and biased by personal experience.
standard suspension = monroe, boge, delphi etc well known brands
off road = personal experiences
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:iagree:...with Dave. I use Monroes, all round on my 3 ton Patrol...nice firm ride ride, but not harsh. Prices are reasonable.
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:iagree:...with Dave. I use Monroes, all round on my 3 ton Patrol...nice firm ride ride, but not harsh. Prices are reasonable.
Where did you buy yours from mate?
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It's been a while since I put them on, but it was a UK supplier who had them in stock...try a quick search on the Bay and they should turn up.
Mine have been on for almost 7 years now and still going strong! I got a set, later on, to suit my KJ and after 5 years, they are doing the job.
Would you like me to search them up and post a link?
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Eurocarparts sell Bilsteins what more would you want?
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I recall Gasser saying that the Edelbrock Performer IAS mono tube shocks did the job perfectly, just a thought
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It's been a while since I put them on, but it was a UK supplier who had them in stock...try a quick search on the Bay and they should turn up.
Mine have been on for almost 7 years now and still going strong! I got a set, later on, to suit my KJ and after 5 years, they are doing the job.
Would you like me to search them up and post a link?
Yes please - I looked and seems theres loads of different types. I found this one on the bay, any good?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2x-Jeep-Grand-Cherokee-Monroe-Adventure-Rear-Shock-Absorbers-Damper-New-RL0-/291335268511?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item43d4ef689f
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At risk of starting something here :greggmo:
Bilsteins vs Monroe vs Edelbrock ??
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Yes, they should be fine for general road work...it's what I'm running. I'll get busy this morning and find the front ones for you.
They used to have a kit for the KJ which included the shocks and coil springs, but they weren't available in the UK, when I was buying.
Everyone will have their favourite brand...with their own stories to tell...I've always had a good run with Monroes and I'm not looking to change anytime soon.
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http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2x-Monroe-Sensa-Trac-Front-Shock-Absorbers-Genuine-Damper-Suspension-/291296283403?pt=UK_C
This is an ok place to start.
Scroll down the advert and you see a list of part numbers for most of the other brands, as well.
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http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Monroe-Quick-Strut-Complete-Strut-Assembly-171577R-/331324445762?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4d2479d442
This is the sort of thing I was talking about for the front...just have to find the one which fits yours.
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On the subject of what brand of spring to use, I have replaced springs on numerous road cars in the past and used both Bilstein and Monroe.
Neither brand have ever given me any problems...
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On Cloggie JF:
2-inch lift kit for WJ containing 2-inch budget boost incl 2x new top wishbone & 2x new ajustable bottom wishbone, 1 y/o, new price 635 euro. you can have it for 400 euro.
Last post 6th Jan. Can chase for you (pics, more details) if you want me to.
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monroe and billsteins would be on the top of my list for standard part replacement.
had the pleasure of experiencing a monroe development car with dial a ride suspension and a ride with one of their development drivers. on course on std. settings then remote adjustment by pc to optimised and the car handled even better after two runs and adjustments. settings stored it was then ready for customer demo.
remote damping and rebound is the way to go but then it's too expensive to justify for normal use
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I have had no luck with bilsteins !!
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At the end of the day, it all comes down to personal preference (based on your own research, or experience)...and the size of your wallet. There are some really good brands on the market....sadly, some of them have really stupid price tags!
Both Monroe and Bilstein have been around for a very long time and both have a very good, proven track record. There are some brands to steer clear of...Gabriel being one of them!
Based on my own experience with Monroes, since the early '70s and a wide variety of vehicles, I can see no reason to jump ship now!
If I had to replace the shocks on the Nissan, my choice would still be Monroe Sensa-Trac..all around.
Works for me.
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At the end of the day, it all comes down to personal preference (based on your own research, or experience)...and the size of your wallet. There are some really good brands on the market....sadly, some of them have really stupid price tags!
Both Monroe and Bilstein have been around for a very long time and both have a very good, proven track record. There are some brands to steer clear of...Gabriel being one of them!
Based on my own experience with Monroes, since the early '70s and a wide variety of vehicles, I can see no reason to jump ship now!
If I had to replace the shocks on the Nissan, my choice would still be Monroe Sensa-Trac..all around.
Works for me.
Works for me too then! Thank you very much for spending the time to look for those options for me on the bay, really appreciate it. I've never done much with suspension before, other than changing stock for stock, so its great to hear others views and advice.
Think the Monroes are the way to go, just need to find some of those complete sets you put a link for, that hopefully doesn't involved uber expensive US shipping. I like that the set changes everything in one go, and I don't have to beg/borrow/steal a spring compressor. I did a quick lookup on the WJ through the Monroe website, and there are options for Jeeps with up-country suspension, and without. I have no idea what i've got though, so thats going to have to be the next thing to find out.
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http://www.roughcountry.com/suspension-lift-kits/jeep-suspension-lift-kits.html?vehicle_model=302&vehicle_year=73
RC on my WJ.
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Always a pleasure to help someone...plenty of guys on here have done it for me!
What goes around...comes around. :icon_winkle:
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I have had no luck with bilsteins !!
didn't some come delivered with the wrong gas inside???
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I'm struggling to find UK based suppliers (or at least i'm not using the right search term in Google!) for the Monroe quick struts. Can anyone make recommendations for places/people they might have used before? Or would I be better off sucking the cost of shipping up, and getting it from the US? Through the bay, each strut is about £75 for shipping, but i'm sure I could contact a company to get a better rate for 4 etc.
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I had the same problem finding a UK supplier for those things...I can't remember who I got them through in the end, but you might want to try Mike at Jeepey...he's a very helpful guy.
Unless your rear end is really soft and saggy (the Jeeps, not yours), I doubt you will need any more than good shocks (Sensa-Trac) to firm up the ride. I wouldn't waste a lot of money buying the quick strut kits for all four corners...probably nice to have, but not essential for road use.
IMHO, of course. :icon_winkle:
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I had the same problem finding a UK supplier for those things...I can't remember who I got them through in the end, but you might want to try Mike at Jeepey...he's a very helpful guy.
Unless your rear end is really soft and saggy (the Jeeps, not yours), I doubt you will need any more than good shocks (Sensa-Trac) to firm up the ride. I wouldn't waste a lot of money buying the quick strut kits for all four corners...probably nice to have, but not essential for road use.
IMHO, of course. :icon_winkle:
I've been in touch with Mike (incredible fast response!), and he has said he doesnt know much about the Monroes but that he's heard good things, but doesnt look like he stocks them. His recommendation was Old Man Emu - http://shop.jeepey.com/product/15-suspension-lift-wj-diesel-omewjd/. How does the £800 compare to changing to Monroe shocks and springs?
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Mike is really good to deal with...and very knowlegable. Price seems a bit high, but that might be me being a tight arse. Try asking for a discount...mention Birties and anything else you can think of...worth a punt. :icon_winkle:
From memory...and it was a few years ago...my lot cost me something like 650 quid, delivered.
Hope that helps you.
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From someone who has spent thousands on WJ suspension, the best setup for on & off road was OME diesel HD springs and Rough Country Hydro (the cheaper ones not gas) shocks.
Cheapest place for OME springs was TBR UK (www.tbruk.com)
Also if making the effort get new spring seat rubbers & new rear A arm bushes (check all bushes really) Will make a world of difference over a stock shagged out suspension, and will give around 1.5-2" of lift.
I did run my WG on the above with 2" spacers and it was the best setup I have had on it, much better ride than the IRO 5" long arm I have on now (and may be going back to the OME 3.5" lift with short arms myself)
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What scrw says about the bushes makes a world of sense. Mike can supply all the rear control arm bushes and even the dreaded balljoint, if you think you need to do them. I did all mine via that route and was about the 120 pound mark. Gaz will remember repacking and forwarding all that stuff to me over here!!
It's a piss easy job to do, especially if you have a nice clean concrete floor to work on...and someone nearby with a press. I did my own with a hydraulic jack and a bit of inventive thinking....and my floor was rough, sandy gravel, back then.
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Second that, when I lifted my WJ it also involved polybushes all round.
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From someone who has spent thousands on WJ suspension, the best setup for on & off road was OME diesel HD springs and Rough Country Hydro (the cheaper ones not gas) shocks.
Cheapest place for OME springs was TBR UK (www.tbruk.com)
Also if making the effort get new spring seat rubbers & new rear A arm bushes (check all bushes really) Will make a world of difference over a stock shagged out suspension, and will give around 1.5-2" of lift.
I did run my WG on the above with 2" spacers and it was the best setup I have had on it, much better ride than the IRO 5" long arm I have on now (and may be going back to the OME 3.5" lift with short arms myself)
Thanks Scrw, I've been looking for rough country since you posted about them. On the link below there's the 2.0 and 2.2 versions. Are either of these the models you're talking about or if not, do you think they'll be good?
www.llama4x4.com/page3.htm
It looks like these guys are the only UK option for RC but price seems very reasonable
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Dave at Llama is a good chap, if you ring him, make sure you have a cup of tea already made & you have half an hour to spend :icon_winkle:
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RC have changed their range, best speak with Dave.
I do have a set of new a arm bushes and front upper bushes if you want them, no good to me now. PM me