Birty Dastards Jeep Club

Tech Forum => Workshop => Topic started by: Nosebolt on November 26, 2008, 07:28:42 PM

Title: woo hoo
Post by: Nosebolt on November 26, 2008, 07:28:42 PM
finaly sorted out the cash for my one piece axel kit, Dave at llama4x4 has a shipment expected mid december and hopefully is bringing them over for me :lol:  :-D  :-D
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Post by: Tank on November 26, 2008, 07:30:53 PM
Hope your jeep wasnt Quadratrac...... :roll:
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Post by: Nosebolt on November 26, 2008, 08:56:44 PM
na amc20 narrow
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Post by: Tank on November 26, 2008, 09:12:08 PM
Thats good then,practically give away some one piece shafts but for Quadratrac
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Post by: Nosebolt on November 27, 2008, 07:54:13 PM
job done (allmost) a set of AlloyUSA one piece shafts ordered and should be here in 6-10 days, as long as Im not in one of the HRH holiday camps  :lol:
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Post by: xr6jeeper on November 27, 2008, 08:56:45 PM
Quote from: "Nosebolt"
job done (allmost) a set of AlloyUSA one piece shafts ordered and should be here in 6-10 days, as long as Im not in one of the HRH holiday camps  :lol:

What make are they? moser?
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Post by: Nosebolt on November 27, 2008, 09:34:12 PM
these ones (http://http://www.1sourcemfg.com/store/catalog/product/view/id/308/s/aly12125-1976-1982-jeep-cj-1-piece-rear-axle-kit-alloy-usa/category/3/)
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Post by: xr6jeeper on November 28, 2008, 11:01:03 AM
I cant see what make they are , the main thing you need to know is are they friction welded or are they forged.
Take a look at this,
http://www.jpmagazine.com/techarticles/ ... index.html (http://www.jpmagazine.com/techarticles/39578_amc_20_axle/index.html) :wink:
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Post by: Nosebolt on November 28, 2008, 12:49:20 PM
they are made by 'Alloy USA'

(http://http://birtydastardsjeepclub.com/forum/userpix/1234_axles_1.jpg)
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Post by: xr6jeeper on November 28, 2008, 08:01:26 PM
I personally have never heard of aa, the names superior, moser, currie bros, etc ring bells because they all are famous for axle components.
are they forged?
dunno
http://www.shopwiki.com/search/ALLOY+CJ ... C+AXLE+KIT (http://www.shopwiki.com/search/ALLOY+CJ+AMC+20+1+PC+AXLE+KIT)
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Post by: Bubba on November 28, 2008, 08:05:59 PM
they are fine trust me    moser are cool but i bent mine
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Post by: xr6jeeper on November 28, 2008, 11:08:20 PM
Quote from: "V8 Bubba"
they are fine trust me    moser are cool but i bent mine

Maybe you should get some made by strange, you wont bend those :-)
Title: End play
Post by: xr6jeeper on December 05, 2008, 11:51:22 AM
Hey nosebolt! how much end play are you giving the shafts?
Title: Re: End play
Post by: Nosebolt on December 09, 2008, 12:31:03 PM
Quote from: "xr6jeeper"
Hey nosebolt! how much end play are you giving the shafts?


I have this fool proof technique, first I read the instructions, and then when I am fully confused I ring Bubba :evil:
Title: axles
Post by: xr6jeeper on December 09, 2008, 05:08:19 PM
The only reason i ask is cus ive read some have shims and some dont,  :-)
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Post by: Bubba on December 09, 2008, 06:23:16 PM
the factory uses shims on the lefft hand side to set both sides viea a block that pushes on the righthand side thus setting both sides moser shafts do away the the shims n block not sure about the aloy usa ones
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Post by: Nosebolt on December 30, 2008, 04:39:35 PM
Kit has arrived :lol:
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Post by: Bubba on December 30, 2008, 09:54:00 PM
well done mate
Title: End float
Post by: xr6jeeper on December 31, 2008, 11:24:04 AM
So whats the end float, 4 thou ish?
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Post by: Nosebolt on December 31, 2008, 04:48:53 PM
it says the outer face of the bearing should be 0.020"-0.060" proud of flange at end of axle, dont know how that relates to end float :oops:
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Post by: Nosebolt on December 31, 2008, 04:59:16 PM
Not the best day I have ever had in the workshop

Bloke whose press I was going to use went home early.

Flange seized onto shaft on passenger side, broke my puller. Had to break old bearing to get brake plate and retainer off.

Then like a prat I used an old outer bearing shell to drift home the spacer in the axle tube and got it stuck.

So ended the day with CJ on axle stands, no shafts or wheels fitted, a bit jammed in where I don’t want it and some broken tools. Here’s hoping next year gets better :-?
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Post by: normalbloke on December 31, 2008, 06:10:59 PM
That's dis-heartening.However,walking away and having a break(enforced or not) will make the next session far more productive and before you know it,the bugger will be fixed and running stunningly!I have just re-mot'd my 360 CJ7 and have been roaring around in it like a fool over the Crimbo hols,kind of forgot how much fun it is!

Good luck!
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Post by: Nosebolt on January 01, 2009, 07:21:38 PM
OK back to where I should have been yesterday, all the bits that needed to come out are out, gears are back in the dif, and only destroyed one bit that was needed (making a new spacer tomorrow when m8 lets me into his machine shop).
So as long a Snowy is about so I can use his press might get the CJ rolling again tomorrow.
Did use the down time to pretty up a few bits.

(http://http://birtydastardsjeepclub.com/forum/userpix/1234_moto_0349_1.jpg)

(http://http://birtydastardsjeepclub.com/forum/userpix/1234_moto_0353_1.jpg)

(http://http://birtydastardsjeepclub.com/forum/userpix/1234_moto_0357_1.jpg)(http://http://birtydastardsjeepclub.com/forum/userpix/1234_moto_0350_1.jpg)

I really don’t like the rear springs or the shackles but will just have to be added to the list of things needed, along with new prop shafts and front shock towers.
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Post by: Nosebolt on January 02, 2009, 05:19:59 PM
allmost all done, just fluids to do. (bleed brakes & oil in diff) and put wheels back on  :-D
(http://http://birtydastardsjeepclub.com/forum/userpix/1234_100_1087_1.jpg)
(http://http://birtydastardsjeepclub.com/forum/userpix/1234_100_1088_1.jpg)
(http://http://birtydastardsjeepclub.com/forum/userpix/1234_100_1089_1.jpg)
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Post by: Bubba on January 02, 2009, 07:53:20 PM
well done dood
Title: time
Post by: xr6jeeper on January 03, 2009, 11:04:00 AM
So how long do you think it would take to do the job if everything went to plan 8-)  and why did you take the crownwheel out, did you have to remove a pin ?
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Post by: Bubba on January 03, 2009, 11:25:50 AM
i take it he needed to remove the pusher/spacer block that sets the preload for the rh side shaft it is retained by the centre pin of the diff
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Post by: xr6jeeper on January 03, 2009, 11:46:57 AM
Quote from: "V8 Bubba"
i take it he needed to remove the pusher/spacer block that sets the preload for the rh side shaft it is retained by the centre pin of the diff

Cheers dude, ill be doing mine soon  :-)
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Post by: Nosebolt on January 03, 2009, 01:36:31 PM
yea I made a stupid mistake, the new bearings for the one piece shafts are press fit on shaft and clearence in axle tube, the old bearings are the other way round, slide on shaft- press fit in tube, I wasn't thinking and used old bearing outer to drift in the spacer then couldnt get it out, thats why i took the ring gear out.

without stupid cockups job should have been no more than 6 hours, i did a few outher bits while i could too that has added some time.
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Post by: Nosebolt on January 03, 2009, 03:21:01 PM
it drives :lol:

as I may have said before not happy with the front prop shaft, are there any major issues with running without the shaft in 2WD while i get it recond?
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Post by: xr6jeeper on January 03, 2009, 04:41:35 PM
Quote from: "Nosebolt"
it drives :-)
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Post by: xr6jeeper on January 03, 2009, 04:43:13 PM
Quote from: "Nosebolt"
it drives :-)
edit; dunno what happend there :oops:
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Post by: Nosebolt on January 03, 2009, 05:49:41 PM
next question; is worth reconditioning the standard prop or get an after market jobby, I ask this bearig in mind the lift means the original prop is probably a bit over extended.

also is the u bolt conversion worth while? those pidily bits of bent tin holding the UJ in place do worry me
Title: prop angles
Post by: xr6jeeper on January 03, 2009, 08:46:52 PM
Right! where to start, if the angle of the transmission and the pinion are the same you wont get vibration and you wont wreck uj`s. If the pinion angle is more, one uj will run faster than the other(does that make sense)
this will vibrate and knacker uj`s.you may well be able to run the stock shaft depending on the amount of lift.
Cardan joints can be found on toyota hilux front drive shafts, so you may be able to get something made up for a fraction of the price just remember to get the cardan welded onto the transmission end of the rear drive shaft(i think)
This might help you decide :wink:
http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/tech/driveline/ (http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/tech/driveline/)
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Post by: greggmo on January 03, 2009, 11:44:03 PM
Quote from: "Nosebolt"
next question; is worth reconditioning the standard prop or get an after market jobby, I ask this bearig in mind the lift means the original prop is probably a bit over extended.

also is the u bolt conversion worth while? those pidily bits of bent tin holding the UJ in place do worry me


the u bolt style uj straps always seem a better idea to me and i am fairly sure fatso will say the same.
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Post by: Bubba on January 04, 2009, 12:09:28 PM
clear off lard ya retard


yes the ubolt prop straps are far stronger than the later flat strip of metal strap


drive shafts are an interestin thing  the front shaft an almost all 4x4s is longer than the rear one and hence runs at a much flatter angle than the rear in comparison    and yet the front is often treated to a carden cv joint while the the rear is left as nature intended running open yokes and i for one have had more reason to look at repair nurse the front shaft not the rear

can somone explain why the rear rarly if ever contains a cv unless you have bought a tom woods explode a shaft on the after market
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Post by: xr6jeeper on January 04, 2009, 01:04:15 PM
Dunno! good question, maybe its something to do with cost when manufactured or maybe they wear out quicker than uj`s, cause they are turning so fast on the rear axle, whereas when they are on the front  they are in 4wd and turn slower , whadya reckon :-)
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Post by: daggie on January 04, 2009, 01:07:22 PM
Quote from: "xr6jeeper"
Dunno! good question, maybe its something to do with cost when manufactured or maybe they wear out quicker than uj`s, cause they are turning so fast on the rear axle, whereas when they are on the front  they are in 4wd and turn slower , whadya reckon :-)
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Post by: Nosebolt on January 04, 2009, 01:29:49 PM
After reading the linked article from xr6, it seems I need UJ’s on the front, flanges are almost parallel, 1.5* difference, don’t think I can do anything to loose this last bit without rotating the tubes in the diff housing as it will affect the castor to much. UJ’s aren’t the problem with the front shaft it’s the slide, there is a load of side to side play.

The rear looks like a candidate for a CV, big angle at transfer box, almost straight at rear diff.

So next question is where to get front repaired and new rear fabricated?
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Post by: xr6jeeper on January 04, 2009, 08:36:30 PM
Theres a guy on ebay breaking a cj7 is that any good
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Post by: Nosebolt on January 04, 2009, 08:43:06 PM
was thinking new or at least new parts to refurb
Title: castor angle
Post by: xr6jeeper on January 04, 2009, 08:43:43 PM
Quote from: "Nosebolt"
After reading the linked article from xr6, it seems I need UJ’s on the front, flanges are almost parallel, 1.5* difference, don’t think I can do anything to loose this last bit without rotating the tubes in the diff housing as it will affect the castor to much. UJ’s aren’t the problem with the front shaft it’s the slide, there is a load of side to side play.

The rear looks like a candidate for a CV, big angle at transfer box, almost straight at rear diff.

So next question is where to get front repaired and new rear fabricated?

You can sort the front prop out but its a bit of farting about, you need to grind the welds of on the balljoint flange (carefully). then you can spin the front axle either with shims, or re mount the spring perches.
Then turn the balljoint flange to the desired castor you want and re weld.
Like i said its a lot of furking about but thats how its done. :-)
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Post by: xr6jeeper on January 04, 2009, 08:44:55 PM
Quote from: "Nosebolt"
was thinking new or at least new parts to refurb

Andrew or julian at lighthouse jeeps in garboldisham, norfolk.
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Post by: greggmo on January 04, 2009, 09:33:48 PM
IMS props in supliers. 8-)
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Post by: Nosebolt on January 04, 2009, 10:50:59 PM
lighthouse brill for service kit but not had much luck with upgrades.

found IMS web site (not in suppliers :cry: ) will give em a call in the week.
Title: Propshafts
Post by: wildwood on January 05, 2009, 11:49:47 AM
I used these guys http://www.baileymorris.co.uk/ (http://www.baileymorris.co.uk/) local to me Cambs (St Neots).
They shortend an XJ prop for the rear to get the carden and I went with normal skinny prop for YJ front but 8" longer due to Klune and exhaust. For dynamic balance they recommend  as wide a diameter as poss to avoid vibes.
I've got hubs on front so doesn't matter. Rear is perfect 4and half inch lift SYE and no vibes even at 80 (not often achieved)

I do have a front TJ prop (fat as a rear prop) has cardon on it could be retubed or shortened as has dent in tube. (Sitting in shed)

These guys do props the size of sewer pipes for trucks they are good, also do rally cars and are less money than Yankie stuff.
cheers Jez
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Post by: Nosebolt on January 08, 2009, 12:14:55 PM
found a place in Bristol that will make me a custom pair of props :cry: but then again will probably take me that long to sort the pinion play :roll:
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Post by: Nosebolt on January 10, 2009, 09:41:50 PM
Here we go again! :wink:

Rear not quite so easy was advised of some pinion play, didn’t expect as much play as I found considering it was all apart last week and I didn’t notice it then (not sure if I just missed it or if I caused it).
About 5 mm in-out and same up-down, not good. So rear axle is in bits for the second weekend running to find out what bits are needed, but will have to be back together and drivable on Sunday regardless, so fully expecting to do it all again next weekend after I get the parts. :roll:

As long as I have a drivable Jeep by the 27th when the Isuzu is SORN’d I’ll be happy
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Post by: Bubba on January 10, 2009, 11:28:59 PM
pinion bearings +crush sleeve.........enjoy
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Post by: Nosebolt on January 10, 2009, 11:41:51 PM
That’s what I am expecting, but not taking any chances this time so going to check the shaft and case before I order the parts
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Post by: Nosebolt on February 04, 2009, 04:23:01 PM
IT"S DONE!!!!!

finished the pinion bearing today (Thanks for phone support Kev  :lol:

(http://http://birtydastardsjeepclub.com/forum/userpix/1234_moto_0386_1.jpg)

she even looks like she is smiling now
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Post by: Bulldog67 on February 04, 2009, 04:29:35 PM
mmmm, silk knickers full of custard, now yer talkin  :cry:
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Post by: isle of man on February 04, 2009, 07:14:23 PM
You really must trim that front bumper...
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Post by: Nosebolt on February 04, 2009, 09:57:56 PM
Quote from: "isle of man"
You really must trim that front bumper...


which bit? allready cut a bit off
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Post by: Panic mechanic! on February 05, 2009, 10:52:46 AM
it needs the ends trimming down a  few inches
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Post by: Bulldog67 on February 05, 2009, 07:55:44 PM
and some black american racing wheels to replace the fandangos  :wink:
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Post by: Nosebolt on February 05, 2009, 08:19:39 PM
Quote from: "Bulldog67"
and some black american racing wheels to replace the fandangos  :wink:


would love em m8, but to many thing on the list before that, ugly as they are they work :-?