Topic: Re: Cherokee 2.5TD no crank no start problem dead electrical starting system (Read 8297 times)

Richo · « **on:** January 21, 2020, 07:26:45 PM »

XJ Cherokee TD no crank no start dead instrument panel electrical system, any advice on what to look for changed the ignition switch and checked all grounds and fuses.
Any guidance or advice would be appreciated
Ian

Further info
I have owned my XJ for nearly ten years its always started first time every time never had any problems with the vehicle before.
I went to start the jeep turned the key to start all electrics instruments and gauges came on but nothing happened when i tried to start it, starter didn't energise, i check every fuse all are good changed the starter rely still nothing, read on a US Forum to jump the rely terminals 18-30 and it turned the engine over and started up straight away, left it running for 15 minutes to warm up, switched off refit the rely tried to start it again and nothing, pulled the rely and jumped the terminals and it started up again, that tells me everything is good to the starter, cleaned all the grounds rechecked all the fuses and relays all were good, as are the battery terminals, leads and battery.
Was told its the ignition switch so disconnected the battery fitted a spare ignition switch, reconnected the battery but now i have lost all electrical power to the instrument panel nothing works and the immobiliser light has now come on permanently.
My interior/exterior lights, radio, electric aerial still work but nothing else, i dont have much electrical knowledge or test equipment so need help and advice as what to look for, i cant find a local mobile auto electrician to have a look so i am now well stuffed!!

Widjeeper62 · « **Reply #1 on:** January 27, 2020, 11:23:32 AM »

Hi Ian,

I don't know about the XJ but I had a similar issue with the immobilizer of my JK last year and I had to get my Jeep on the back of a recovery truck to the main dealer to get it it reprogrammed along with the keys.

I've got a good Scan tool Autel Maxidas but even that was not good enough. I think only the Main Dealer computer can help you with immobilizer issues.

Good luck.

Chris

Dave69 · « **Reply #2 on:** January 28, 2020, 07:27:14 AM »

Quote from: Richo on January 21, 2020, 07:26:45 PM

read on a US Forum to jump the rely terminals 18-30 and it turned the engine over and started up straight away, left it running for 15 minutes to warm up, switched off refit the rely tried to start it again and nothing, pulled the rely and jumped the terminals and it started up again, that tells me everything is good to the starter

this says you found the problem - solution would be replace the relay. but it appears you took a step forward and replaced the ignition switch as well which may have confused the security system.

on the back of someones assumption you changed the ignition without any confirmation or diagnosis

?? not sure what immobiliser you have but i'm guessing its an after market unit, auto electrician maybe your answer with a view to disconnect the security system purely to get the jeep to start

Richo · « **Reply #3 on:** January 31, 2020, 08:05:15 PM »

Dave, thanks for the reply, whats got me baffled is why the engine wouldn't starg with the rely in but does when you jump it, have tried several relys none of them allowed the engine to crank and why after removing the postive battery lead to change the ignition switch apon replacing it should i lose all power to the instrument panel.
It sounds more like a loss of power to or from the fuses, because all the fuses are good i havent got any ideas were to go next.
The immobiliser must have kicked in due to the loss of power to the ignition.
I understand the electric dystem on these vehicle is a bit had hock and doesn't follow logic, i dont have much knowledge with electric systems on cars so am completely stuck, no mobile electrians with 40 miles of me so thats a no no as well.
Dont want to scrap it but its not looking too good.
Cheers Ian

Richo · « **Reply #4 on:** January 31, 2020, 08:24:21 PM »

Hi chris
Thanks for the reply, i havent a clue about the immobiliser details i understand these were fitted on arrival in the uk by an independent company, there going on for 20 years old now so probably out of business.
I dont have any dealers nearby or have the type of money required to uplift it and move it to one either and then pay their rates to have a look at it.
This would cost more than the jeeps worth so it would need to be scrapped. That would be a great shame because its only done 50.000 and is in excellent condition,

bgbazz · « **Reply #5 on:** February 01, 2020, 05:11:20 PM »

Dave, is there an easy way for him to bypass the immobiliser and isolate it from the circuit? I'm no guru, but I recall something similar to this problem with my daughters car, years ago. It had been stolen off her drive and the turds had snipped all the wires off her immobiliser and took some shortcuts with some creative bypasses.

Just a thought because I know only too well how electrickery stuff can do your head in'.

Stay well guys.

Richo · « **Reply #6 on:** February 02, 2020, 12:05:19 PM »

Hi
I dont think its possible to bypass or disconnect the immobiliser from the starting system on UK spec XJ Cherokes, I read on an old posting someone with a similar problem being told the system added to these vehicles on arrival in the UK is a piggyback setup with the original system and thats why it cant be removed.
It would be great if someone with knowledge of these immobilisers could confirm or deny if this is true, i could live without the immobiliser system being fitted but would like to still have central locking and i think the two would be hand in hand with each other.
Ian

bgbazz · « **Reply #7 on:** February 02, 2020, 12:55:23 PM »

You may well be right mate...thinking back, I seem to recall someone else on here having a similar problem and that "piggyback" thing was mentioned, but it was quite a while ago.

Sorry I can't help.

The Smiths · « **Reply #8 on:** February 03, 2020, 10:21:59 AM »

If it a 1999 then it will have the SKIM immobiliser which is part of the controllers - think it is 3 "ecu's"?? - not too sure.

People have done it with bits from other cars/ getting stuff from US - but you need to change them all, or it will work 50 times and then switch itself back on.

But google SKIM immobiliser, they were not fitted in US.

Normally if it had kicked in there would be a light left on the dash, and engine would start for second or 2 and then cut out. If this is not happening hen it may not be the problem yet.

The Smiths · « **Reply #9 on:** February 03, 2020, 10:24:27 AM »

Just reread your post - when you changed ignition switch - did you just do the cylinder part - and keep the key reader which is part of the immobiliser system?

Dutch · « **Reply #10 on:** February 03, 2020, 10:27:40 PM »

Tons of reading pleasure re Jeep immobilizers in the search function. Try different searches such as TD2.5 immobiliser, cherokee immobiliser, cherokee start problems, TD2.5 start problems, 2.5TD ZJ start problems ..... etcetera. The broader search term will give all the mechanical stuff as well but you'll find some gems in there from days & characters gone by.

http://www.birtydastards.com/frm/index.php?topic=14321.msg163320;topicseen#msg163320

http://www.birtydastards.com/frm/index.php?topic=11034.msg119721;topicseen#msg119721

http://www.birtydastards.com/frm/index.php?topic=17409.msg200997#msg200997

http://www.birtydastards.com/frm/index.php?topic=21553.msg253535#msg253535

Richo · « **Reply #11 on:** February 06, 2020, 08:18:07 PM »

Hi Guys
Thanks for the replys, i am not totally convinced this is an immobiliser issue, think its more likely a power supply problem but i cant figure it out at all.
I only replace the ignition switch not the key barrel or actuator mechanism because there working correctly. It was after i disconnected the battery to change the switch when i reconnected the battery i had lost all power to the instrument cluster, that i believe triggered the immobiliser.
I spent an entire afternoon checking and cleaning all the grounds, fuse etc but i hasn't made any difference, its all dead, only the central locking, lights, radio work which i presume are on another electrical circuit not activated by the ignition system.
I can jump the starter rely terminals and the engine turns over but obviously will not start without the pre heaters or immobiliser working correctly.
I have searched the internet for these issues but due to the yanks not having the diesel engine models i cant find anything showing a similar problem.
This has got me beat and might now mean i have to scrap what is otherwise a very good Cherokee.

Dave69 · « **Reply #12 on:** February 16, 2020, 12:42:31 AM »

wiring diagram and use a multimeter to trace the path. painstaking and frustrating but thats going to be your answer. dont jump to conclusions while doing it

Author Topic: Re: Cherokee 2.5TD no crank no start problem dead electrical starting system (Read 8297 times)