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Author Topic: Every one hates VM  (Read 7407 times)

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duncjeep

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Every one hates VM
« on: November 16, 2010, 06:53:53 PM »

Hi all,Im new here,I have a 1995 cherokee TD...but now I find that the vm has a massive hatred towards it (what Iv read here) I have'nt much knowhow of these engines and Id love to make the Cherries engine sweet and reliable.My engine runs ok,but is being abit of a pig to start..I went to change the glow plugs but I think I need to remove the fuel pump.Any help in this area please??...Im not scared of any kind of spanner work,and I would like to hear of any other oil burner vm supporters :icon_biggrin:.Thank you . ..ps where the hell do you get manuals for vm beasties? :icon_eek:
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tim_aka_tim

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Re: Every one hates VM
« Reply #1 on: November 16, 2010, 07:24:25 PM »

Looks like you had trouble posting and made a poll. No matter.

Have you done the glow plugs or not? Thats the most common starting issue on these engines, so make sure you
do that first. Don't worry about anything else just yet. As to the heads - cross that bridge when you come to it.
Make sure it has regular oil changes, as the issue with cracked heads is poor lubrication in the upper galleries
caused by inadequate oil flow due to sludge (I read somewhere). It's derived from a boat motor which has totally
different requirements from a car engine.

A manual for the 2.5TD is here http://www.scribd.com/doc/19477634/vm-25-manual but I cannot say what year it's
for.
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Dave69

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Re: Every one hates VM
« Reply #2 on: November 16, 2010, 07:53:58 PM »

i have owned one and paid for it.

the vm lump is great when it is running well. good torque smooth engine and quiet compared to the green oval variety. BUT yest it is a very big BUT, when the engine fails it is a massive hit to the pocket even when you are fixing it yourself.

the heads are interchangeable between the pre and post facelift as the engine change was from a mechanical to an electronic fuel pump. Change the rubber connecting hoses that joint the injectors together as any leaks in these causes the diesel to drain away resulting the engine having to prime itself at each start. Be aware of the individual gaskets as you can buy a one piece variety but the end plates will need to be machined to suit or they will be too tall.

to keep these running well is a matter of period maintence which includes a reasonable quality oil and keeping the coolant in good condition rather than leaving it for long periods of time as you can with a petrol. Another point is to keep the engine standard if you want more power or torque buy a petrol or another vehicle.

It's not a real hatred to the engine it's a matter of how poorly adapted the engine was for automotive use, and due to this and the poor care by result in the failure help is constantly asked on here.

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Bishops Finger

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Re: Every one hates VM
« Reply #3 on: November 16, 2010, 09:42:20 PM »

Aye...regular coolant and oil change..
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wildrover

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Re: Every one hates VM
« Reply #4 on: November 16, 2010, 11:43:55 PM »

I don,t hate my VM...i love it , but then i have to , seeing as its gonna get me to my beloved in Moscow in March...

I had the cylinder head problem when i first got it , cured by lobbing in some expensive chemical thats done the job real well....I have had the hydraulic adjusters on the pushrods collapse twice  , and at the moment its going through a don,t really want to start when cold phrase , but when its going right its great...

It got me all the way from my home in Poland to Kiev in Ukraine , again to see my Russian beloved , and got me home again , only problem was a broken rear spring due to the cart track they call a motorway...

Would i buy another Jeep..for sure i would...would i buy another one with a VM engine...errrr maybe not....   
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The Smiths

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Re: Every one hates VM
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2010, 01:38:43 AM »

VM's are OK when well maintained

flush coolant and oil.

Poor coolant is the killer of them


as for your glow plug probelem - just change the 3 you can do easy and see how it goes :icon_winkle:
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duncjeep

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Re: Every one hates VM
« Reply #6 on: November 18, 2010, 06:43:10 PM »

Thanks guys for the info.I have flushed out the radiator/engine.and topped it up with a good quality coolent mix.Iv got the glow plug power cable off(a fiddly exercise :banghead:) ..now I will get cracking with the plugs .I may just change the 3 I can ,without disturbing the fuel pump..buy a new battery and give her a blast.Want to get her MOT'd before xmas..and the real snow hits.I went 5000 miles this year on a 1 month euro trip to Croatia and back in a tdci 130 mondeo and a 600kg caravan,(oh the shame lol)It was a great trip but I was so confined to motorways,tolls and proper sites..bit too clinical...so next year I wanna take the cherry with a roof tent and go abit nuts in Slovenia..(top place)Anyway I'm looking forward to rocking up the cherry for the overland trip(on a budget) and I'm sure to keep you all  posted on resurrecting the mighty XJ.Again ,thanx for the good advice ..cheers :icon_jook:
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pattho0

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Re: Every one hates VM
« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2010, 07:55:35 PM »

I also have a -95 Cherokee 2.5TD. I bought a CD with the factory workshop manual on British ebay, I'm sure you can find it if you make search. The VM-diesel does have a bad reputation because of the cylinder heads cracking. The simple thing is to make sure that you don't turn off the engine right after having you've been driving on the motorway. Let it idle for a few minutes before turning it off. This also applies when it is extremely hot. Another common problem is the hydraulic lifters for the push rods. When there is dirt in the oil it can make the hydraulic lifter get stuck which causes the push rod to "pop out". It happened to me a couple of hours ago and I just came in after fixing it in -14 C :icon_sad: However, it is an easy fix. You just take off the rocker cover, unscrew the appropriate rocker arm, pop in the push rod, screw everything back again. Took me about 30 minutes to fix :icon_biggrin:. I've just changed the oil and that's probably why it happened - the new oil loosening up some of the deposits in the engine. I can recommend a yahoo group dedicated to this engine http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/VM-dieselengine-group

Anyway, despite all this I LOVE my XJ :098: and plan to built it into an expedition-type of vehicle. Tried it out with a roof tent and a 2" lift with 30" tires during the summer holiday and I'm hooked :icon_super: Waiting until this spring to do a 3" lift, a snorkel, extra battery and some armour etc. The diesel has more torque than the IL6 and twice the mileage... Good luck but don't go anywhere without a set of tools :icon_winkle:
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Dave69

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Re: Every one hates VM
« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2010, 08:48:37 PM »

You just take off the rocker cover, unscrew the appropriate rocker arm, pop in the push rod, screw everything back again. Took me about 30 minutes to

you'l soon master this fix and get it down to just over 10 mins. Try it in a suit and tie on the way to a presentation
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The Smiths

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Re: Every one hates VM
« Reply #9 on: November 29, 2010, 09:21:15 PM »

try welding a washer onto the rocker to stop it popping out :icon_winkle:
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wildrover

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Re: Every one hates VM
« Reply #10 on: November 29, 2010, 10:43:06 PM »

When my pushrods popped out  it was due to the hydraulic adjusters collapsing in bits....These of course cannot be changed without taking the heads off...However , you can change the internals of the adjuster with carefull use of a magnetic screwdriver and some nimble fingers..done mine twice now...

And..when its going right..i love my VM cherokee...

Apart from this , the overheating problem , which was cured by magic fluid . and the water pump exploding in bits , i have not had much problems with the Jeep....

 It would have been better with a Mercedes diesal engine in there of course...
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Bubba

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Re: Every one hates VM
« Reply #11 on: November 30, 2010, 05:30:08 PM »

the vm is a self harmers dream lap it up boys
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duncjeep

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Re: Every one hates VM
« Reply #12 on: November 30, 2010, 05:48:12 PM »

Aah! whats a few skint knuckles..I like the old oil burner.And its been great in the snow we've hed up here..even though its been in a field as the MOT work hasnt all been done yet :icon_biggrin:
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pattho0

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Re: Every one hates VM
« Reply #13 on: November 30, 2010, 10:12:54 PM »

Quote
However , you can change the internals of the adjuster with carefull use of a magnetic screwdriver and some nimble fingers..done mine twice now...


This is good information! :icon_biggrin: How is it done????? :017: It is my third pushrod from the front that pops out (it has happened three times in a year, I guess that particular adjuster needs to be replaced but I don't want to tear down the engine...). Please, provide a description of how it is done and what tools that are used :100: :100: :100: :100: :100:
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wildrover

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Re: Every one hates VM
« Reply #14 on: November 30, 2010, 11:28:54 PM »

My Polish friend and mechanic Gutek did the job on my VM...After takng the rocker cover off he got the bits of the collapsed adjuster out with the aid of a magnetic screwdriver , then replaced the internals of the adjuster from a new one that i had bought..The trickiest bit is getting the clip that hold the internals in place to seat properly...

I can,t post any pics of the process , dam its hard enough just being able to see down the small hole you have to work in...  Its just a matter of having the patience and dexterity to do it...and having somebody to hold a torch for you...

To replace the adjuster itself is more tricky , its held in place by a clip , which in turn is held in place by the cylinder head , but thankfully i got away without having to do that....

If you buy a new adjuster its easy enough to take it to bits and see what bits you need to get out of the old adjuster.....
                         good luck...!
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