Topic: NON STARTING 2.5 DIESAL XJ CHEROKEE (Read 11504 times)

daggie · « **Reply #25 on:** January 08, 2010, 04:15:13 PM »

I'll go and take a pic

Dave69 · « **Reply #26 on:** January 08, 2010, 04:22:52 PM »

this might help,

view of starter motor below turbo and relief valve (just) on left hand side of picture

daggie · « **Reply #27 on:** January 08, 2010, 04:36:20 PM »

hope this works

tag · « **Reply #28 on:** January 08, 2010, 04:46:13 PM »

Starter relay is in the pdc in the engine bay (power dist rebution center) it will tell you on
the inside of the lid ..............

wildrover · « **Reply #29 on:** January 08, 2010, 06:30:02 PM »

Thanks guys , great pics....I can see the starter motor on your pic , but thats probably due to the fact you have removed most of the turbo...i am kinda hoping i won,t need to do this , and probably due to severe wishfull thinking i have convinced myself that the starter motor and solenoid are not getting any power , and the problem lies elsewhere...The fact that the lights do not dim at all when trying to start it makes me think there is no current drain to the solenoid or starter....

I have identified the starter relay in the fuse box already when i was checking all the fuses , i took it out and cleaned the contacts , but i don,t know how to test if its working or not... You say i can check the starter by shorting out the contacts of the relay , do you mean poking a wire into the holes that this relay plugs into..? and if so , which holes..? I don,t want to melt anything by poking the wrong hole ..!

i do have a multimeter thing for checking voltage and continuity , but i don,t pretend to know how to use it properly...any tips on how to check the relay is not fried...?

Mike Pavelin · « **Reply #30 on:** January 08, 2010, 07:49:42 PM »

Easy relay test....swap it for the horn relay and see if the horn still works.

wildrover · « **Reply #31 on:** January 08, 2010, 08:35:47 PM »

Great idea..i didn,t think of that...! Just supposing the relay turns out to be the problem....can i swap the relay for the horn over with the starter relay in order to get the beast running again . or are they different enough to be damaged...? I imagine the starter relay has to pull a lot more juice through it than the horn relay...

Mike Pavelin · « **Reply #32 on:** January 08, 2010, 09:11:47 PM »

They're the same.

Dave69 · « **Reply #33 on:** January 08, 2010, 11:06:11 PM »

the turbo is fully intact just the exhaust manifold has been removed. the only picture i could find of where the starter is located. the solenoid is attatched to the starter with the relay and fuse in the big fuse box seen in the above picture. the relays are all the same in design and operation but some are a bit more robust. As Mike says just pull the horn relay and put that one in place (std 4 pin relay)

wildrover · « **Reply #34 on:** January 09, 2010, 05:53:28 PM »

The saga continues... I went out today , put a fully charged battery in the beast , tried the horn , yep , thats working fine , so i swapped the horn relay with the starter relay....nothing..! Not a sign of the solenoid or starter doing anything at all....,My Jeep is the 1997 mk2 model and does not have the doodah that means you need to depress the clutch pedal , leastways i have never had to do that since i bought the Jeep in early summer , but just in case it does have one that has suddenly begun working i tried it with the clutch depressed...still nothing...!

confused and clueless...!

tag · « **Reply #35 on:** January 09, 2010, 06:10:39 PM »

Hi, have a look at your clutch pedal theres a switch it's a round tube thing fastend to the back of the pedal arm you can work it back and forwards with your hand without moving the pedal, it sounds as if the immobiliser is on and blocking the starting, mine was the same as i posted before. check the wires are ok you can bypass this switch .......cya

tree man · « **Reply #36 on:** January 09, 2010, 07:35:58 PM »

We're running out of ideas here

How about checking the ignition switch. I have had dodgy starting symptoms when the contacts in the ignition switch were not connecting properly (it was a Discovery!)

tag · « **Reply #37 on:** January 09, 2010, 09:10:28 PM »

Ok, I've been out pulled the starter relay on my jeep bridged it out with a 2 inch length of wire this cranks the engine over, as mike said, so if you have changed the relays over and still no joy you've just eliminated the relay not the circuit that turns the relay on off! looking at the diagrams there is a switch on the clutch on your jeep and this is part of the circuit that powers the relay!! so your next move is to bridge out the relay to see if it cranks over pin numbers to bridge out are 30 and 87 look on the bottom of the relay, not 87a, this will bypass the clutch switch! the fuel pump relay is next to the starter one so if you mix up you will hear the pump run have the ign on when you bridge the relay. good luck.......cya

Dave69 · « **Reply #38 on:** January 09, 2010, 11:43:39 PM »

you are still getting the instrument cluster lighting up and the glow plug relay icon being lit (for a few seconds)

Mike Pavelin · « **Reply #39 on:** January 10, 2010, 08:33:13 AM »

Have you tried bridging the relay socket yet? This will eliminate any problem with the starter, solenoid or wiring after the relay.

wildrover · « **Reply #40 on:** January 10, 2010, 11:35:37 AM »

Latest news...I have bridged the contacts on the relay..30 and 87...nothing at all , not a peep out of anything...The instrument panel lights up as normal , the glow plug light comes on , and goes out after a few seconds as per normal....I have had a poke around the clutch pedal , can,t get in there to see much , but i did find a wire with a plug on the end thats not connected to anything...As i say , from the first day of owning the Jeep i have never had to depress the clutch to start it , so if my Jeep has this immobiliser connected to the clutch it has never worked , possibly due to being disconected or bypassed by a previous owner....I am a complete muppet when it comes to electrics , so shooting in the dark here...! Can anyone confirm that my model of Jeep has this clutch immobiliser..?

Dave69 · « **Reply #41 on:** January 10, 2010, 11:41:26 AM »

the mk1 diesel i owned never had a clutch pedal sensor for imobilising the engine. this imobiliser is mainly for the american market and fitted to the petrol manual cars so their cars can't start when in gear.

tag · « **Reply #42 on:** January 10, 2010, 12:30:32 PM »

Hmm, i have the circuit diagram for your year 1997 2.5 diesel Cherokee bridging out the relay should crank the starter! the starter motor is hard wired direct to the battery , the solenoid on the starter is activated by the relay ,the relay hot side of the relay is fed by a 30 amp fuse in the pdc if you have a volt meter pull the relay and test pin 30 you should get 12v ign on 0v ign off , this side of the relay is direct to the solenoid, if it tests no power check the 30 amp fuse in pdc. the key and clutch lockout switch operate the coil side (switch) of the relay, if you get 12v when you test pin 30 you may have a bad earth to starter...hope this helps.......

wildrover · « **Reply #43 on:** January 10, 2010, 12:35:50 PM »

I didn,t think it had one...Well thats eliminated one possibility ..! I am sure its some small problem that an auto electrician would spot in an instant , i can,t believe its a major problem , but maybe thats wishfull thinking..? The Jeep was working perfectly well when i parked it up in the garage , and apart from the spell of cold weather , nothing has happened that could have caused a major meltdown...

wildrover · « **Reply #44 on:** January 10, 2010, 01:01:26 PM »

As i mentioned before i am a muppet when it comes to electrical matters...So....i stuck the plus probe on my test meter into the socket where the 30 pin goes , the minus probe i put to an earth contact..? am i doing it right...? Anyways...poking the the probes into all the contacts on the starter relay with the ignition on did not produce any sign of voltage..! All the fuses in the pdc are ok... shall i give up now...

?

wildrover · « **Reply #45 on:** January 10, 2010, 01:40:18 PM »

Its a runner...hoooooray.....thanks for all your help...Right now i have to go out...but when i return i will reveal the sad thruth about my muppetry....-

gazjeep · « **Reply #46 on:** January 10, 2010, 02:59:51 PM »

At last !!!!

Something nice & simple I hope

Go & get loads of supplies then come back & tell us all about it

tag · « **Reply #47 on:** January 10, 2010, 03:08:53 PM »

Phew!!.............

wildrover · « **Reply #48 on:** January 10, 2010, 03:40:34 PM »

The lesson i have learned today from my Jeep is....never assume anything....!

During the past few days , while checking all the usual stuff that a non auto electrician would poke at in desperation i checked the fuses , both the ones inside the Jeep , and the ones in the under bonnet pdc...It was cold , i could not feel my fingers , and i hadn,t brought my pliers to pull the fuses....Luckily the fuses had a pair of small contacts on the top which meant you could check them with a meter without needing to pull them out...The only fuse that did not have these contacts was one that is numbered 29 in my handbook , and is apparently the headlight switch fuse , so i ignored it....today i pulled out that fuse , more in desperation than anything else , and guess what..? It had blown..! I changed that fuse....bugger me the Jeep burst into life at the first try despite it being minus ten here....

So the handbook is telling lies...what is marked as the headlight switch fuse is obviously an ignition fuse....Typical is it not...the only fuse i did not check is the one that had blown , and turned out to be the one that sent my Jeep into a coma...

Many thanks to all you guys who tried to solve my problem . .i learned quite a bit about my Jeep electrics in the process....Maybe you have learned something from my muppetry..... never assume anything... thanks guys...

daggie · « **Reply #49 on:** January 10, 2010, 04:07:07 PM »

Author Topic: NON STARTING 2.5 DIESAL XJ CHEROKEE (Read 11504 times)

tag

wildrover

Mike Pavelin

wildrover

Mike Pavelin

wildrover

tag

tree man

tag

Mike Pavelin

wildrover

tag

wildrover

wildrover

wildrover

tag

wildrover